Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone? Euphonium-Tuba and General Music Forums (2024)

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• 1stop

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  #1

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  01-26-2012, 09:48 PM

  I am playing a Besson & Co. "Prototype", 198 Euston Road, London, England. Serial No. 77074. What year was it made and is it a Baritone or a Euphonium? The three valves are copper.

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• tonewheeler

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  #2

  01-26-2012, 10:18 PM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  A picture might be helpful.

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• pam

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  #3

  01-26-2012, 11:27 PM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  Hard to say which it is without seeing the horn.

  The serial number dates it to 1903/1904.

  Besson made both (as well as double bell euphs and double bell baritones) during that period, so it could be either.

  The position of the valves relative to the top bow isn't a reliable identifier, since some Besson euphs from that period had them extending above the bow and some Besson baritones had them below the bow.

  The only reliable identifier is how quickly the bore expands after you've passed the valve block.

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• DaveBj

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  #4

  01-27-2012, 05:26 AM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  Pull the main tuning slide and try to reverse it. If it goes in reversed, then the bore is the same on both sides, and it is a baritone. If it won't go in because one side of the slide is a larger diameter, then the bore is expanding, and it is a euphonium. (Be smart -- don't force the slide in the wrong way; you should be able to tell pretty quickly.)

  David Bjornstad

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• pam

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  #5

  01-27-2012, 09:44 AM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  Originally posted by: DaveBj

  Pull the main tuning slide and try to reverse it. If it goes in reversed, then the bore is the same on both sides, and it is a baritone. If it won't go in because one side of the slide is a larger diameter, then the bore is expanding, and it is a euphonium.

  That works for most post-Boosey/Besson merger baris and euphs, but not for turn-of-the-twentieth century Besson & Co (or Boosey and Son or B&H) models. Pre-merger models, typically had the main tuning slides BEFORE the valve block.

  Here's a couple of Besson & Co euphonims from roughly the same time frame as the OP's:

  Class A "prototype" euphonium serial No 76201 [source: horn-u-copia.net]:
  

  Engraved: Class A 50 medals of honour FB (Initials) Besson & Co "Prototype" 198 Euston Road London England (5 pointed star) Carl Fischer 6 4th Av. N.Y. Sole Agent U. States Gold laquor, original in Low Pitch [source: horn-u-copia.net]
  

  Serial # 59382, Engraved: Class A Besson & Co Prototype 198 Euston Road London England [source: horn-u-copia.net]
  

  And here's a couple of baritones:

  Engraved: Class A | Medals of Honor | B | Besson & Co | "Prototype" | 198 Euston Road | London [source: horn-u-copia.net]
  

  Engraved: Class A "prototype" [source: horn-u-copia.net]
  

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• Euphonos

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  #6

  02-20-2012, 10:25 PM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  Very interesting looking horns..

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• Jhnthn

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  #7

  02-21-2012, 12:23 AM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  I've always been curious about those horns. I'm aware that just because it looks different doesn't mean it's great, I would still like the chance to try one. seems because the side valves point straight out and isn't aimed up at all it wouldn't be comfortable to hold.

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• Ginobombardino

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  #8

  05-05-2012, 11:21 AM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  Originally posted by: Jhnthn ... seems because the side valves point straight out and isn't aimed up at all it wouldn't be comfortable to hold.

  I guess the tilt 4th valve came in a product line after that. The serial no. of my instrument is 97608. All I could find out so far is that it must be pre 1957. Engraved: Systeme Prototype F.Besson Brevete S.G.D.G. Paris

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• daruby

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  #9

  05-05-2012, 01:47 PM

  Besson - Is it a euphonium or baritone?

  This horn is of French manufacture rather than British and is most likely a saxhorn. If that is the original case, it WAY before 1957.

  Doug

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